Ligia Zamora 00:04
Welcome to the New Talent Code, a podcast with practical insights dedicated to empowering change agents and HR to push the envelope and their talent functions. We’re your hosts. I’m Ligia Zamora.

Jason Cerrato 00:18
And I’m Jason Cerrato. We’re bringing you the best thought leaders in the talent space to share stories about how they are designing the workforce of the future, transforming processes, rethinking old constructs, and leveraging cutting-edge technology to solve today’s pressing talent issues. It’s what we call the New Talent Code.

Ligia Zamora 00:38
So, if you’re looking for practical, actionable advice to get your workforce future-ready, you’ve come to the right place. Hello, listeners. Today, we’re so excited for this episode with John Deere. Joining us is Julianne Brown-Meola the head of talent management. Deere is leading its talent revolution with a skills-based approach. As Julianne says all roads lead to skills. And in doing so they’ve built an environment where every employee is in the driver’s seat of their career with a focus on upskilling everyone with a no regret essential future skills. After hearing Julianne’s stories, you will get a better understanding of what it takes to run like a deer listening.

Julianne Brown-Meola 01:25
Thank you for having me. It’s great.

Ligia Zamora 01:28
Tell me in your own words. Let’s get started. What exactly does your team do and why is Center of Excellence I think it’s the first time we’ve come across that at Eightfold.

Julianne Brown-Meola 01:38
First of all, thank you for for having me. That’s a great hype intro. And that’s that’s really how I feel about you know, the COE and the work that we do every day. It really does give me energy. And I think we’re in just the most exciting space in talent right now, at John Deere. Ideally, talent management and our team has a few pillars that all culminate ultimately to ensure that our pipeline and deer is strong and prepared for the future and that all employees have opportunity to in that bucket. We have people development, including leadership development coaching, we have assessments, selection, we have our talent planning, talent review, team and succession, which prepares our leadership pipeline, we have employee engagement, which has now employee experience more so and surveys. And then we have our Learning and Skills team, which is in high demand. And I know a big part of what we’ll talk about today.

Jason Cerrato 02:33
So Julianne, one of the things that we’re looking for with this new talent code podcast is to help practitioners and talent leaders like yourself, think differently managed differently, operate differently. And a lot of them are starting on this journey that John Deere has already started to proceed on. Can you give us a little background on kind of what led you down this path? What were some of the main talent management challenges the organization was facing or was leading you to kind of transform HR for the future?

Julianne Brown-Meola 03:03
I’d say it probably once a week, I truly believe that all roads lead to skills. Everywhere we turned, it was a similar need. So whether it’s career architecture, and you’re building the infrastructure for your jobs and roles are questions about future compensation or recruiting, filling gaps, thinking about future strategic workforce planning, what employees want and are asking for all of those questions can be answered with skills solutions. So really changing our language, and how we structure learning how we structure our jobs, ultimately, and how we structure what we’re seeking to solve big business challenges was in the language of skills. And that’s what led us to start the search. We’re still building that path. But I’m really happy with where we are. And do you feel like we’re keeping up with the industry that’s being built as we’re executing? So it’s been exciting. So

Ligia Zamora 04:07
I’m really interested in how did you get executive buy in I know, John Deere had a new chief people officer join. So talk us through that process? And

Julianne Brown-Meola 04:15
in terms of buying certainly our new CPO, Felicia Prior is fantastic and had had experience in the skill space coming in. And really the priorities on knowing our talent, what skills do we have? So it’s an entirely different exercise to say what degrees are on the resumes of our workforce? Versus what can our workforce do? What do we know? And how are we competitive when it comes to creating the future and really doing things that have never been done in agriculture or in construction and forestry, even John Deere financial, how do we have that mirror to look at and know what our skills are? And that’s a simple question that executives would ask Where can we find someone who does XYZ? Or do we have someone internally who can advise on this, or support a project. And at the base of all of that, if you’re not sure of where those skills are, like, we like to say, the hidden gems, or the unicorns of individuals that may have a job in one area of the business, but a long history and another corporate function, or a different degree that we’re not leveraging, that’s really where some magic can happen. You can say, you know, we have that seal internal, we don’t need to build that, or buy that rather, or get that external or pay consultants to help we can do that. So really, that asked for a mirror of what we are currently compared to where we need to go was a big question. And then offering, you know, we’re a data-driven organization with talent and deer. So what data? Do we have to make any decision or even help employees know what your path could be? And that’s really a big ask around employees is helped me find a path. And that’s much easier said than done. And I’ve done the exercise in years past where I’m mapping degrees, and I’m trying to, you know, figure out what’s possible or skill adjacencies are a big deal. You know, if you’re, you’re close to being skilled, somewhere, where might we have a close skill to what we need? And we can build on that?

Ligia Zamora 06:21
How do you define success in this initiative, for me success, as it relates to skills, and all the effort we’re putting in place, is that, number one, deer is competitive. And we remain so because we have the best talent. So we can know that if we’re investing in building that talent internally, and we know how to seek it out. So number one, that we are a competitive and excellent organization like we have been, we maintain the quality that’s key for us. And to for me personally, that every employee at Deere feels that they have opportunity at Deer. So opportunity for all, no matter what organization you’re in, or what role you have, that you could be successful in what you want to do, or you’re interested in somewhere at Deer. So how do we get the highest and best use from our individuals from our workforce, and also inspire that workforce through what’s possible? When

Jason Cerrato 07:25
you decided to take this skills based approach? And you also said All roads lead to skills? Was there any specific initiative or understanding before where you were looking to monitor a certain skill or add a certain skill? And then was there anything that you were able to discover or learn after from the use of tools like talent, intelligence, looking at it through a new lens AI enabled? Understanding?

Julianne Brown-Meola 07:50
Yeah, what a great question from from the inside, you know, you’re in skills, if you face those different directions. And what you make me think of is really, when all roads lead to skills, that also means there’s a lot of technology, and a lot of research, a lot of suppliers, a lot of consultants that are all speaking skills. So I think where we started was, what do we have right now. So leveraging a tool, like a lot of organizations might use a talent neuron, it’s called so what broadly do we know in the landscape in terms of skills that are on the increase? Or on the decline? That’s somewhere to start? broad general industry skills? Where do we go from there, which are specific to deer? And externally in the market? What are those competitive skills that are on the rise? That’s all very interesting. And you can make a lot of assumptions on that and where you need to go. And then you mentioned the word mirror, but it’s only so helpful to the extent that you can know yourself. So compared to the industry, what is deer look like? Where our skills increasing or decreasing? And a space that you asked, you know, that was? A good place to start is electrification. So for deer and for many automotive companies, this is an everyday conversation around the future of electrification, battery technology, how do we have prepared talent to take us down that path, especially as it relates to our sustainability efforts, what our customers are asking for? It’s very specialized, and it’s not something you can just take a three month course on and and be done. So the long term investment and being very specific on the skills and clicking down from those high level analyses to exact skills that we need was part of the art by individual by a skill and thinking we don’t need everyone to do that same electrification role. So parsing out where the where the needs are and then really digging in. Now,

Jason Cerrato 09:51
as you’re pulling this together, you get the intelligence layer, you get the insights and the recommendations, but there’s also the operational piece of this as well. So there’s been a lot of discussion around the transformation of the HR function and breaking out of silos and more collaborative, systemic work and team based approaches to a lot of this. As you’ve gone on this journey and started to deploy this capability, are there any quick kind of examples you can share? Or things that resonate around how internally to HR, some of the teams are working together differently? Talent Acquisition, talent management, you mentioned, employee experience? Is there anything that’s coming from that out of this kind of transformation?

Julianne Brown-Meola 10:31
Absolutely. And it’s exciting to think a lot of people might call this the skills ecosystem or the skills universe. And it’s all very true. But we’re all we’re all in it. So now, how do we find our place in that ecosystem, and most importantly, connect the dots to one another to make this work. So as you certainly can’t have a TA team or an acquisition team solely focused on degrees, while your development team is solely focused on the skills, you really got to speak the same language, in doing the work a lot. A lot of the work has been bringing the business along and educating ourselves and educating the business and our workforce on what that means. Because skills, on its own might mean a lot of different things. In terms of working together better. We have a strategic workforce planning effort. And that’s helped us really define seven years out, where will the workforce have specific needs and technology? Where will changes be in terms of need or decline? And we may not always be able to buy or borrow that talent. So how do we build it and we do want to invest in dear employees who are fantastic already. So with that being said, our TA team with the technology often can source that talent externally based on skills. And now with our most recent updates in terms of our technology, specifically now and eightfold, we can have our internal employees have that same experience. So they’re representing themselves and their skills and using that data. So our TA team is using the same lens to ta external that we are developing internal, which is really powerful. And then our HR partners are speaking with their business areas, and the same skills language are SMQs are telling us what skills need to focus on. I don’t need research to do that, necessarily. And they’re saying what the priority is for the future of their equipment or for the future of their business. And so like I mentioned electrification, one thing I learned a lot about, about the business as I go through different conversations, but one example was around batteries at the high level, battery operated equipment is very heavy. So you can’t just do a easy switch within the equipment of May of making, you know, an electric autonomous tractor of the future, which we do have an autonomous tractor now. But as you add that it would might crush the fields, for example. So just the level of skill and detail needed for these sorts of complex machines is incredible. Knowing the skills, like I’ve said, and knowing what we need is a partnership between ta what are we buying TM? What are we building? And the business? What do we do?

Ligia Zamora 13:15
We talked a little bit about the employee experience, we asked them to enter so much information, validate their skills, etc. So what point should they expect? Obviously, you did a presentation, you sold it to them, and we’re gonna roll this out? How did you set expectations of when should you see value in this initiative? And how did you define value?

Julianne Brown-Meola 13:36
It is such a balance of what is sharing the power of what we’re doing for the future? And what what this is going to do versus over promising? And how do we bring the business along and individuals on a journey that’s absolutely bumpy. It’s new technology. It’s AI, trying to integrate so many systems, it doesn’t work unless at the individual level, you’re engaging with the tool, it takes time. You’re busy. So there’s so many components. And so what I want to tell I would say I maybe I tell the vision of what’s possible one day, but make it very clear that this is step one. And in terms of what individuals are asking for, you know, what interests you have matter what skills you bring to the table matter. And we have a tool now that we need you to tell us and showcase your skill set and showcase your strengths. It’s been really well received that you can even showcase your certifications, for example, your patents, so we have a lot of individuals, where can I put that and show that so the tool to be able to have your own living sort of resume that’s available has been really powerful on its own. And as we hit a technology glitch of something that’s not working yet, often and maybe because we haven’t caught up or the tool hasn’t caught I’m just being transparent. It’s not going to be easy, but you’re on the front line. And that’s why we need you to figure this out with us. And it’s gonna be great.

Ligia Zamora 15:08
I love that.

Jason Cerrato 15:09
One of the ways that talent intelligence has been described in the market by analysts and others, is that by having it be this combination of intelligence and capability and experience and operations, it becomes a win win for both the organization and the employee, and the applicants and the candidates and everyone along the cycle. It sounds like that’s something you’re experiencing right now with a variety of audiences within John Deere.

Julianne Brown-Meola 15:34
Absolutely, it’s one thing for let’s say, hiring managers to have a strong experience. It’s another for an individual employee who is even new to the company to have all of this information and feel like they’re at the in the driver’s seat for their future. That’s really what we want to have is there. When is, before you had mentioned Lee, he of having, you know, we’re kind of telling you what your career path is, and what these options are, with the technology. And when we talk about skills, we’ve really handed that over to the employee to be transparent about what skills have led to for other employees? What skills are underneath these roles, what gaps you have, that’s maybe one of the more critical and exciting parts is assessing proficiency in the tool? What is your level where where do you need to be, and it’s very clear, and you can find that out, you have the keys. So that is kind of a more immediate win at the employee level. And then for managers, and I think a lot of employees, what’s most exciting when I talk about not over promising is this idea of project marketplace, in within the tools or within the skill space.

Ligia Zamora 16:47
I think sometimes talent hoarding can happen, it kind of goes counter against sort of like, Ah, my short term goals, versus the benefit to the company of having this ability for employees to be able to move around and find new positions based on the skills that they’re acquiring. So how did you overcome that, or any advice for our listeners on how to think about it, how to position it,

Julianne Brown-Meola 17:10
To start, I would measure it. So you know, know where those groups, those cohorts are moving, if at all. So, for example, we looked at mobility by level, by our success or population by our high potential talent, we looked at areas that were, let’s say, giving the most talent and areas that were receiving the most talent, and just really start with the data. So that kind of tells a story of where how if individuals are moving other data was actually asking what’s important to leaders and hiring managers when they’re looking at talent. And what the top experienced in one study that we did was employees that have had cross functional cross business experience. So if we’re claiming that’s important, then we need to put effort and a metric there. And using that data, we have had conversations to say, well, that’s possible. And a leader just yesterday was asking me as a senior leader in technology around can I find someone who has through these tools, who has had experience in XYZ technology in our construction and forestry, business and our Ag and Turf? And it’s a simple yes, we can. And we can share what skills are there without making assumptions of what you learned in other space? So now that we can do that, our next question at hand is really, are we going to set targets? And some companies do that? And we’re kind of in the midst of leaning in there, but getting very specific with that data? Who are the individuals who have moved? And what do we assume? Or what is true about the benefit to those individuals from moving around to your point, not hoarding talent, which is easy to do, even between internal businesses with great talent, who love the work that they do and continue to grow there? How can we be really intentional? So

Ligia Zamora 18:54
I’m hearing three things. One is definitely data. So make sure that you understand what’s going on, and you’re measuring the improvement and you’re setting targets. A second one I heard strongly is alignment to values, practicing what you preach at John Deere. So alignment being bought into this holistically. And the third thing is selling the benefit to those leaders, because everyone is experiencing skills gaps, and or talent shortages, because your industry is undergoing changes, so you’re not going to get there just by buying.

Julianne Brown-Meola 19:23
Even better. This summary sounded better than what I thought that my answer was. But when you do that technology to when you made me think is one of the great benefits and we look to do this through assessments, or through skills, technology is just casting a bigger net. We know a lot of companies focus on relationships and what you know, knowing your talent, but with technology, if you can challenge your assumptions or challenge your decision and thinking with a broader net, that can really make a difference too. So what are we where are we not looking? What have we not thought of and I think that the data and the technology will help us do that.

Jason Cerrato 19:57
When you were talking about exporting and receiving, giving talent and working with leaders, I think you’re getting on the cusp of working with individuals to manage differently. And think about this differently around not just, I’m losing someone to another team, but I’m also making it easier for me to receive someone from another team and move talent around the organization. And then I know you were talking about measurement, how do you measure success? And I think you’re on the verge, if not already starting to change, maybe what are some of your criterias for success? Or how are you identifying wins across the business? Does that sound right?

Julianne Brown-Meola 20:31
It does, it does. And I liked how you mentioned, you know, redefining, because we talk about that it pops up here and there. So even this week, we were talking about skills or development in skills, and how does that redefine how you’re managing or how you’re developing someone and rewarding exactly how you’re incentivizing? How you recognize it changes things here and there that it helps to have a conversation and be a call it out, you know, in the moment. So I love that point. That is redefining how we operate, how we lead, how we look for talent, how we grow talent, and ultimately how we work. For

Jason Cerrato 21:09
the folks that are out there listening. Some of them are just starting their journey, and many of them may be tuning in just to learn more about this topic and about this transformation. Obviously, you’re a few steps ahead of them on the path from implementation to deployment. Are there two or three key learnings or takeaways that maybe you either prepared for or didn’t see coming that are at the top of your mind to share with the folks listening? Yes,

Julianne Brown-Meola 21:32
I’m sure there are many more when sort of six months to a year in. So there’s a lot of interesting things. And I think that the landscape is moving so much. And everyone is building everything to answer all the questions but not to get distracted by what what a tool can do, or what’s on the roadmap for the future. But instead, just keeping it as simple as you can does XYZ solve my problem? And how, and really staying focused how we work with it, being in the HR space, becoming a besties is absolutely a help in this space. And you certainly have collaborative relationships. But I think as we’ve evolved in technology works in an agile way, some parts of HR do just how you work with that partner, I don’t want to underestimate how important that relationship is. So having a really collaborative team that’s working on this helps a lot. So it’s not just an HR initiative is not just a talent initiative, but really building a team that’s invested in the success of what the outcome is so Smedes, who want those skills to be highlighted leaders who need the talent, it who has the expertise to ask the right questions, and your talent team that can help build that collaborative team on the front end is really critical.

Ligia Zamora 22:52
You’re a company of 75,000 workers and billions and billions in revenue, and you have quite a large team. So there’s some of those that are maybe a lot smaller, what advice do you have, in terms of focusing, not biting off more than you can chew so that you can show some early success? Maybe a couple of things you can think of

23:10
my career started in nonprofit and academia, I love having scrappy, workable solutions for what you need and absolutely don’t have to invest. You know, the biggest help for me is remembering that there are great industry experts that are solving the same problems I am outside of the walls of deer. So making sure that I’m talking to individuals that have done this before, what really happened, what didn’t go well, and hearing the real story versus maybe a consultant or a supplier has one side of a story, but being down in the trenches, how did it go. So really get an external perspective. And then in terms of, of solving, there’s a few parts of the business where we looked at a higher level and didn’t get so granular on skills and said, What are the you know, 10 No Regret skills that we know, no matter what role you’re in, in this organization, and five years and 10 years that we all need? That might be a journey of AI? Or augmentation, how is that going to affect our jobs? Might be data and analytics? 101? How are we going to upskill in that space? So choose the really big ones, and then have a plan at large. It doesn’t have to be a fancy or, you know, a university program. But how are we going to invest learning time intentionally, to upskill in this space on the no regret skills, and that’s really powerful, especially if you’re doing that at scale.

Ligia Zamora 24:41
So on a personal note, I’m curious, did you always want to be a PhD in industrial organization? What did you want to be when you were when you were younger?

Julianne Brown-Meola 24:50
Probably a lot of things, you know, everything from a fashion designer to an astronaut. So I think just having always an interest in science answers probably the one similar thing from when I was younger. So chemistry sets or science clubs or math club or camps. And going into college, I just love to learn, which is a fantastic trait when you’re in the talent space, and also makes it difficult to decide what to do did for me it’s a good problem. It was yeah, it continues to be. And so I did go into nonprofit which is where I always a space I love to work in I love to work and I worked at Make A Wish at the mid south and learned so much there. We talk about solutions when you don’t have a lot of resources exactly the question. It teaches you a lot that way. But I also knew if I didn’t go back to school soon that I might not ever so I just took the opportunity and stayed as long as they would let me until I finished my PhD in industrial organizational psychology. And what I love about that space is how difficult it is to take science and translate into real quick, meaningful actions and solutions. How can you be the bridge to take what you know the direction needs to be or what will be impactful and make it real and bring others on the journey. You can’t just know things. How do you apply it to make employees healthier and the workforce healthier? The workplace healthier?

Ligia Zamora 26:15
Fantastic. You are an amazing asset to John Deere. And everything you’re doing just fascinates me. So I just want to thank you again, Julianne. This has been just fantastic and just really practical advice for our listeners.

Julianne Brown-Meola 26:28
Thank you and I look forward to listening to all your conversations. This is definitely a space that we talk about every day and I learned the most from you all and from my peers in the industry. So appreciate the conversation. It’s been fine.

Jason Cerrato 26:40
Thank you so much.

Ligia Zamora 26:41
Thanks for listening to the New Talent Code. This is a podcast produced by Eightfold AI. If you’d like to learn more about us, please visit us at www.eightfold.ai. And you can find us on all your favorite social media sites. We’d love to connect and continue the conversation.